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Published 3 years ago with 11 Comments

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Conversation 6 comments by 5 users
  • Neurobomber
    +6

    We need to ban guns.

    We like to think that these shooters are somehow different from us. That if we threw enough money at "mental health problems" this issue will suddenly go away and gun nuts can continue to walk around with a murder machine in their pocket all day.

    It won't. We all go through troubling times and everyone has moments in their life where they're put in to a corner and feel like there's nothing they can do but fight or flight.

    The only difference in America is that it's incredibly easy to pick up a gun and fight.

    • kdawson
      +3

      First off banning guns is a stupid example of magical thinking as in if they were gone everyone would be happy and little Disney birds would flitter around dropping flowers. It's like trying to get rid of bad carpentry by banning hammers. The bad part of it is it takes attention and resources from the real problem with is with the people and human anger. Also you should be careful when you mess around with peoples' rights even if you detest them. Who knows when someone will come around and mess with yours? Weaken one man's liberty and you weaken your own. I am left wing and liberal but stupid is stupid. And the extremes of guns rights and gun control mobs have become a religious movement where reason does not exist.

      • Neurobomber (edited 3 years ago)
        +1

        I wasn't aware that Australia was a fantasy world.

        http://www.slate.com/blogs/crime/2012/12/16/g...hooting_could_australia_s_laws_provide_a.html

        Also owning an automatic weapon isn't a "right". When we wrote the 2nd amendment it was when weapons were muskets that took several minutes to load and the accuracy was atrocious. Letting civilians have this level of weaponry is absolutely insane and the rest of the first world seems to be doing just fine without it.

        Except, you know, when our weapons are smuggled in to their country.

        • jenjen1352
          +3

          Exactly. Lo and behold - here are guns! Our last mass murderer used a shotgun, for which he had a licence I believe. Sort of gun you can actually still get in the UK if you have the right reason and a nice locked cabinet in which to store it. Gun control doesn't stop people shooting people, it just makes it less likely that the sort of person who will commit such a crime can obtain a legal gun in the first place. They may not get an illegal gun either. You can't just walk up to the nearest dodgy looking person you see and ask for an AK47.

          Funnily enough the UK doesn't quite well without guns - and our policemen are pretty good at unarmed combat.

    • idlethreat
      +2

      Wholesale banning of guns due to incidents would be like the wholesale banning of cars due to automobile deaths. I wouldn't want to be the person responsible for looking in every garage in america for a contraband car, much less handguns, which are far smaller and more dangerous.

      Like it or not, guns are here to stay in America. Like free speech, they are constitutionally protected. Not one politician wanting to get re-elected will ever vote to get them banned. So, guns stay. What's next?

      I think that user /u/Qukatt is a lot further along on this topic. We have to look at the individual. What happened to him? What made him snap in such a way to force him to want to harm so many others?

      Men in Western society are in a terrible position. Societal pressures from all sides create this sort of creature. Have your genitals clipped at birth. Show no emotions to others, file for selective service or be fined tens of thousands and spend years in prison, get a good job and push hard for every penny so you can find a woman, buy expensive things have a wonderful house and provide for others, work until the day you die.

      If you hurt, you suck it up. If you start feeling depressed, you suck it up. If you need to talk, you shut your damn mouth and get back to work. Lots of people can survive, even thrive, in this sort of environment. Not every one can. Lots need help but aren't getting it due to the deplorable nature of Mental Health in the States.

      Improve Mental Health, lessen societal pressures, and guys like this vanish. It's a lot harder than banning guns, but it saves a lot more people in the long run.

      • Qukatt
        +2

        Don't get me wrong, i'm still in strong favour of proper gun control. No-one needs automatic/semi-auto weapons, no-one needs more than a couple of personal weapons.

        Going on your car parallel: it makes sense to have an intense training stage, it makes sense to licence people who want a firearm, it makes sense to make it mandatory for them to have a firearm insurance that gets paid out to victims if you are at fault in accidentally or unlawfully discharging your weapon. It makes sense to enforce the rules you already have with regards to felons owning weapons, with regards to them being unsecured around the house.

        Stealing a car, joyriding, driving without insurance or a licence or while banned all gets you in the shit.

  • frohawk
    +4

    You know, I fit that description of a mass murder fairly well in m teens, except for being a girl and not white parts. I wonder why those feelings lead to violence for males so readily as opposed to female?

    Is it really just a matter of raising and culture differences?

    • Qukatt
      +1

      i would posit that it's maybe a part to do with macho culture for men, you're always told to man up and stop complaining and stop crying and X Y Z emotions are for girls and you're not a girl are you you're a man! So behave like a MAN! MEN fix their problem by kicking it in the balls!

      MEN like sex with lots of women and have no trouble getting it and men men men blah blah.

      So I can imagine that many men living with this suffocating and constant narrative find it difficult to safely vent out the emotions they're not supposed to have and to deal with situations that Machoism dictates they're not supposed to be in. Couple that with the attention that violent offenders receive from the media on an international scale and you end up with a pretty disturbing mental cocktail.

      Sadly it doesn't matter how well we raise our sons personally to be kind and sensitive and fine with not conforming to machoism because odds are there's a very pushy and vocal group of boys pushing them to be macho... we all know peer pressure is potent.

      • jenjen1352
        +3

        There's a lot in that argument. And I notice that men are more likely to visibly lose their temper - road rage and the like. Perhaps it is hormones after all...

        Lonely men become mass murderers; lonely women creepy cat ladies.

        • kdawson
          +1

          Don't bring the old loner thing into it. In real life most mass/serial killers have social lives and families. As far as the FBI profile goes, my old forensics professor said FBI stands for fucking bunch of idiots. Don't believe all their PR.

        • Qukatt
          +1

          I wouldn't say it is a loneliness factor but more of a break in reasoning that you get when you no longer know what to do. the brain likes to think it always has an answer so when a person literally has no idea what to do about a situation some people will break down and try to get away, others will shut down and others still will just snap and lash out.

          Men need to understand they can seek help and have the cultural support for them accepting mental and emotional help when they need it.

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