I don't wish to generalize by any means, this is just something that has happened to me and has been fairly unpleasant.
As a disclaimer, I was born and raised as an Orthodox Christian in a country where religion is extremely important. Just so you can imagine, there are 500 hospitals and about 50k churches. I have been taught about God and how we need to worship him, I had a Christian religion class in school that was until 2014 mandatory for any pupil, and I was threatened that I would not pass the class if I didn't make a confession at the church at least once / semester.
I loathe this - I loathe the church, and everything it means. I feel like humans contributing to religion as a means to believe in God can only corrupt the belief, and nothing more.
But I am not alone in this. I have friends who have come to the same conclusion as I have about how flawed everything is, but their approach is different: they made a purpose out of preaching atheism to everybody - just like you would with a religion. This is something I loathe just as much as everything else about the church.
I really wish the people who would join this atheist move would keep to themselves more. I can not deny the existence of a God, just as nobody else can prove it. There are more important things in this world to debate than each person's religion.
If you don't want to talk about religion and atheism, you don't have to. But why do you need me to shut up about it? Should I not offer support to others who are confused about what atheism means and what to do next? Should I not speak up about how people are using religion to justify bad beliefs and bad behavior? Such people certainly feel no obligation to keep quiet about their beliefs so why should I? What does that accomplish?
I don't speak up about atheism and secularism because I'm on a mission to convert the world to atheism. I speak up about atheism because where I live and in many other parts of the world believers make a big deal about whether or not I share their beliefs. If they didn't make such a fuss about it, neither would I. My goal as an atheist is to make atheism irrelevant. I'm not going to shut up about it until it stops being relevant.
I can perfectly see where you're coming from. I have my own opinions about religious things, as I've written above. But the reason for which I expressed them is because someone asked me to do it.
Otherwise, I feel like it's essentially wrong to spread your newly found non-belief onto people who are not demanding it.
If they didn't make such a fuss about it, neither would I.
This is exactly my point. I feel like the people I am talking about (who are in fact good friends of mine in real life) are taking the wrong approach by ganging up on people needlessly and calling them out as if they are on a crusade to save the world, and the other persons are mindless sheep.
Edit: I've seen the same thing happen online far too often, with reddit's /r/atheism leaking onto various unrelated threads.
That's the thing about atheism, it doesn't guarantee anything. Being an atheist doesn't make me smarter, nicer or in any way better than I was before. People who are confrontational like that tend to be bitter or self-righteous, and it's probably not much of a change for them. Certainly it's off-putting to people just like the evangelist who knocks on your door first thing in the morning.
Having said that, there is still utility in being a dick. Since people believe for different reasons, there's no single approach to challenging belief that will work for everyone. A polite, reasoned discourse is best to start with but some people mistake that as validation that their beliefs are worthy of serious consideration and reinforces their belief. Some people believe because they're emotionally invested in it, and they need an emotional approach. But I always recommend against confrontation as the opening gambit.
Finding balance is hard to do, and some people never really find it. When you see atheists behaving like that, talk to them about it and explain it to them.
I don't wish to generalize by any means, this is just something that has happened to me and has been fairly unpleasant.
As a disclaimer, I was born and raised as an Orthodox Christian in a country where religion is extremely important. Just so you can imagine, there are 500 hospitals and about 50k churches. I have been taught about God and how we need to worship him, I had a Christian religion class in school that was until 2014 mandatory for any pupil, and I was threatened that I would not pass the class if I didn't make a confession at the church at least once / semester.
I loathe this - I loathe the church, and everything it means. I feel like humans contributing to religion as a means to believe in God can only corrupt the belief, and nothing more.
But I am not alone in this. I have friends who have come to the same conclusion as I have about how flawed everything is, but their approach is different: they made a purpose out of preaching atheism to everybody - just like you would with a religion. This is something I loathe just as much as everything else about the church.
I really wish the people who would join this atheist move would keep to themselves more. I can not deny the existence of a God, just as nobody else can prove it. There are more important things in this world to debate than each person's religion.
If you don't want to talk about religion and atheism, you don't have to. But why do you need me to shut up about it? Should I not offer support to others who are confused about what atheism means and what to do next? Should I not speak up about how people are using religion to justify bad beliefs and bad behavior? Such people certainly feel no obligation to keep quiet about their beliefs so why should I? What does that accomplish?
I don't speak up about atheism and secularism because I'm on a mission to convert the world to atheism. I speak up about atheism because where I live and in many other parts of the world believers make a big deal about whether or not I share their beliefs. If they didn't make such a fuss about it, neither would I. My goal as an atheist is to make atheism irrelevant. I'm not going to shut up about it until it stops being relevant.
I can perfectly see where you're coming from. I have my own opinions about religious things, as I've written above. But the reason for which I expressed them is because someone asked me to do it.
Otherwise, I feel like it's essentially wrong to spread your newly found non-belief onto people who are not demanding it.
This is exactly my point. I feel like the people I am talking about (who are in fact good friends of mine in real life) are taking the wrong approach by ganging up on people needlessly and calling them out as if they are on a crusade to save the world, and the other persons are mindless sheep.
Edit: I've seen the same thing happen online far too often, with reddit's /r/atheism leaking onto various unrelated threads.
That's the thing about atheism, it doesn't guarantee anything. Being an atheist doesn't make me smarter, nicer or in any way better than I was before. People who are confrontational like that tend to be bitter or self-righteous, and it's probably not much of a change for them. Certainly it's off-putting to people just like the evangelist who knocks on your door first thing in the morning.
Having said that, there is still utility in being a dick. Since people believe for different reasons, there's no single approach to challenging belief that will work for everyone. A polite, reasoned discourse is best to start with but some people mistake that as validation that their beliefs are worthy of serious consideration and reinforces their belief. Some people believe because they're emotionally invested in it, and they need an emotional approach. But I always recommend against confrontation as the opening gambit.
Finding balance is hard to do, and some people never really find it. When you see atheists behaving like that, talk to them about it and explain it to them.