After reading the books I thought his death was not final since Martin spent a bit of time talking about Jon's ability to jump into Ghosts body. But it wasn't till I watched a few Alt Shift X videos that I see Jon's potential significance in the series. Potentially being a Targaryen and a Stark fitting the whole Ice and Fire thing, being reborn cleanses him of his Night's Watch oath, and the many signs for filling the Azor Ahai prophecy make for a very compelling argument and a nice way to tie up many plot lines.
A lot of people in the ASOIAF fandom seem to hang on to the "released from his NW vows" loophole, or whatever you want to call it. The thing I don't get is... why? It's just a vow. It's not magical. Words are wind. Characters in ASOIAF don't keep their vows all the time. Hell, Jon's already broken his vows -- with Ygritte and with Mance and with Stannis. His vows never have been what would have kept him from assuming a greater role in the ongoings of Westeros.
GRRM keeps hammering in the concept that to err is human, and everybody is human. I don't understand the insistence on that particular point!
From memory, the vows he broke when he went north of the wall were to complete the mission and not get exposed as still being loyal to the Night's Watch. My impression was that he takes those vow's very seriously and has turned down the opportunity to join Stannis in taking back Winterfell and taking control of it. I forget, which vows did he break with Mance and Stannis?
Very good points about Martin pointing out the frailties of human behavior, but I still think Jon will be back. Depending on how the next book/season go, there could be many plotlines tied up with the return of Jon and a start to the conclusion of the series.
After reading the books I thought his death was not final since Martin spent a bit of time talking about Jon's ability to jump into Ghosts body. But it wasn't till I watched a few Alt Shift X videos that I see Jon's potential significance in the series. Potentially being a Targaryen and a Stark fitting the whole Ice and Fire thing, being reborn cleanses him of his Night's Watch oath, and the many signs for filling the Azor Ahai prophecy make for a very compelling argument and a nice way to tie up many plot lines.
A lot of people in the ASOIAF fandom seem to hang on to the "released from his NW vows" loophole, or whatever you want to call it. The thing I don't get is... why? It's just a vow. It's not magical. Words are wind. Characters in ASOIAF don't keep their vows all the time. Hell, Jon's already broken his vows -- with Ygritte and with Mance and with Stannis. His vows never have been what would have kept him from assuming a greater role in the ongoings of Westeros.
GRRM keeps hammering in the concept that to err is human, and everybody is human. I don't understand the insistence on that particular point!
From memory, the vows he broke when he went north of the wall were to complete the mission and not get exposed as still being loyal to the Night's Watch. My impression was that he takes those vow's very seriously and has turned down the opportunity to join Stannis in taking back Winterfell and taking control of it. I forget, which vows did he break with Mance and Stannis?
Very good points about Martin pointing out the frailties of human behavior, but I still think Jon will be back. Depending on how the next book/season go, there could be many plotlines tied up with the return of Jon and a start to the conclusion of the series.